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azmama2's picture

My son comes home today and tells me he had to sit out during recess because some girl pushed him and in defense he pushed her back. The teacher didn't see the girl push him but saw my son push so he was the one who got in trouble, not the girl. I am thinking I will wait this out maybe a day or two and if comes home again telling me this, I am going to have a real problem, I am already not getting a good impression of his teacher. Anyone want to give me some insight? This kindergarten school thing is new to me so I could use some experienced school moms insight.

I would talk with the

Kinder-Mommy's picture

I would talk with the teacher in a non-confrontational way. Tell her what your child told you. Also talk to your child about other ways to deal with someone pushing him (like telling that person to stop or to tell the teacher). Teachers are not able to see everything, so sometimes a child who "didn't start it" can get in trouble. It doesn't matter if you
"start it" or "finish it"... concequences are still there.



Kinder-Mommy is a kindergarten teacher and a mother of 2!

I'm reading this because i

me's picture

I'm reading this because i will be in your shoes in a few years when my daughter starts kindergarten.

I know what i am going to say probably won't be popular with everyone, but i think this experiences will happen to all of our kids. With that said, i wouldn't say anything just yet to the teacher. Instead, maybe take these experiences and teach your son. For example, next time someone pushes you, tell the teacher. Don't push him/her back.

You also posted one recently about him not eating his lunch because he was playing. Now he knows if he chooses to play instead of eat his lunch, he's going to be hungry. I agree that someone your sons age should be supervised, but as we all know....some times things get over looked.

This is all new to you and especially your son and he's learning the ropes if you will. Before you know it, he will be sharing his experiences with his younger sibling when it's their turn to head off to school.



The recipe for perpetual ignorance is: be satisfied with your opinions and content with your knowledge.
~ Elbert Hubbard (1856 - 1915)

Usually the teacher listens

sdebralh's picture

Usually the teacher listens to both sides of the story before giving any discipline. You could ask the teacher why both kids were not punished.
I think he just needs to learn there will be consequenses for any bad behavior whether he started it or not.
It is hard to believe that only he was punished if she pushed him too.
I'm curious to know the entire story.



One Happy Mom in Arizona.

I have a girl so I am

kelli748's picture

I have a girl so I am speaking from experience. Girls have a "stealth mode" that they rely on to get boys in trouble. Girls don't even have to physically touch/push a boy, they learn early on that buttons can be pushed through hushed tones that make boys react. The boys react/retaliate and BAM no recess. I also have a boy and his little sister can play him like guitar hero. She knows exactly what she has to do to get him to respond in a certain way (push his buttons). Oh yes, we the parents have caught on. We have shared this "evil ability" of our daughters with our son - did it help. Nope, he still responds in a retalitory way and gets caught....

Also, email the teacher and just tell her that your son shared his plight at school and that you and him had a long talk about pushing and it should not happen again, but if it does to please let you know. This is somewhat passive/aggressive, you are letting the teacher know that you and your son communicate and that you are planning to be active in his school life. She might think twice before reacting in the future.

Good luck and just remember that kindergarten teachers often know WAAAAAY more about us (out of the mouths of our babes) than we would prefer, so its best to stay on their good side. ha. Open House one year my son's teacher told me that they were talking about how to save natural resources and he told the class that his mommy and daddy share water because they shower together but are real clean cause they are always in the shower.....

This advice is great. Let

Life2Short's picture

This advice is great. Let the teacher know you are dealing with this issue at home, it's been discussed, and you are an involved and fair parent. The teacher will really appreciate this and be more open to discussing other issues with you as they arise knowing that she/he will be dealing with a reasonable parent.



The best way to predict your future is to create it. ~Peter Drucker

My daughter will start

momto1lil1's picture

My daughter will start kindergarten next Monday so I'm sure I'll go through something like this at one time or another. My question - are the actual classroom teachers out with the children at recess or are their aids? I just am remembering back to when I was in elementary school and the actual classroom teachers never were out on the playground at recess, there were aids out there in charge of watching the children.

I am going to air on the side of not confronting the teacher and instead talking to your son and teaching him that hitting or any other physical violence is not the way to retaliate whether or not he was hit or not. Instead teach him to go to the teacher and tell her what happened and deal with it that way.

I'd wait a few days and see

zoomom's picture

I'd wait a few days and see how things go. Chances are, the little girl will get caught pushing other kids and the teacher will know who starts the problems.



Paz

I would chat with the

brookeromney's picture

I would chat with the teacher without blaming and talk to your son about telling an adult when someone is doing something to him that is not nice or makes him want to be not nice.

I would start a reward system if he has good days...like 10 in a row and you go get an ice cream or something. The positive reinforcement works well for my kindergartener.

Another thing my son likes is when I tell stories. You might say, "I remember when I was in Kindergarten and a boy pushed me and I was really mad, so I pushed him hard back and then I felt sad inside and got in trouble. I wish I would have just talked to my teacher instead."



Brooke Romney is an unbalanced mom of three young boys who constantly has too much to do, and too little time. She writes the Mom Beat column for The Gilbert Republic.

besides what happened, a boy

differentdrum's picture

besides what happened, a boy should be taught never to hit or push a girl.. Little boys eventually become grown men who can physical abuse women to get their way or what they want from them. Studies show that boys who are allowed to hit girls/sisters at an early age grow up to be men, who feel it's ok to slap or beat a women. And especially when their mothers come to their defense right away and condone these actions. I am not saying that girls should be hitting boys and getting away with it, but I personaly feel that boys should never never never hit a girl, And a man should never never hit a women.. THey should learn to control their tempers and walk away.. I don't think that if your husband pised you off and you slapped him, you would want him to smack you in the face.. My brothers (4) were all taught to never hit a girl or their sisters for any reason, and believe me we(4sisters) could pull our brothers strings although my parents were on us when we started something and we didnt get away with it..Plus my mom and dad treated each other with respect. Now on the other hand my MIL always came to my husbands and his brothers defense when they were younger and my brother inlaw has blackened the eyes of many of his girlfriends, and the a hole will say, well she yelled at me or she pushed me or whatever,, it doesnt matter... My husband on the other hand knows that if he were to every lay a hand on me that, that would be the end of him and he would be looking at me behind bars..At the same time I have respect for my husband and I dont yell or scream at him or push him.. we are 20years strong so far..



" just my Opinion" LOL

good lord - they are kids

me's picture

good lord - they are kids right now. Maybe 5 years old. Lets not mark them as abusers quite yet. It was one push at 5 years of age. Give me a break!!

And in my opinion.......girls should not be putting their hands on boys, teenage males or men either. EVER!!!



The recipe for perpetual ignorance is: be satisfied with your opinions and content with your knowledge.
~ Elbert Hubbard (1856 - 1915)

My son (who is very bright

MiriamVS's picture

My son (who is very bright and has always pushed himself academically) was accused of 'bullying' by his 3rd grade teacher in our school back in VA. This was very surprising, because he never showed any aggressive or violent tendencies, so I called his teacher to ask about it. She informed me that he wasn't PHYSICALLY bullying, but what she termed 'verbally' bullying another child. So I said "you mean he made threats?" Nooooo, according to her his crime was: "He uses advanced vocabulary words and phrases that the other children don't understand. He's doing this to intimidate them."

I pressed for further details and she said: "He made a girl cry today. Susie told him not to talk in lunch line, then she started talking to her friend so your son called her a 'hypocrite' and it really upset her." To which I responded: "you mean he used a word in the proper context --- because Susie WAS being hypocritical --- but because she was ignorant of the definition of that word, my son is a bully? My son is the villain here and little Susie is the victim? Is that what you're saying, seriously?"

The teacher then started sputtering and became flustered and I just sat there calmly. When she finished I simply said, "I think both you and Susie owe my son an apology, and I'm not going to punish him for having an advanced vocabulary and using it correctly as the situation demanded. Maybe you can use this as a 'teaching opportunity' for the kids who don't know what 'hypocrite' means and encourage them to expand their own vocabularies."

That was the last call I got about 'verbal bullying' or anything else regarding his behavior! I think she got the message loud and clear that the PC Police were going to be getting some pushback from me. I agree REAL bullying is a problem in schools, but this was just assinine!!!



New to AZ --- and missing autumn leaves and the smell of apple orchards!

MiriamVS - sounds like the

me's picture

MiriamVS - sounds like the teacher was intimidated by your son and his vocabulary. This was asinine!!



The recipe for perpetual ignorance is: be satisfied with your opinions and content with your knowledge.
~ Elbert Hubbard (1856 - 1915)

you must have all boys.. And

differentdrum's picture

you must have all boys.. And as I said, girls should be taught not to antaginize (spl?) boys, but there are those that do.,
But facts show it starts at a young age.. What is wrong with teaching boys to never hit a girl?? Is that to old school for you?? I suppose we should ask abuse women if they deserved it and to stop complaining for being hit or slapped around.
Lets not wait until it's to late, and then make excuses for them..
Maybe if the mom sold her eggs, it could be their own sibling their smacking. or for that matter marrying. (sarcastic)



" just my Opinion" LOL

My point is that REAL

MiriamVS's picture

My point is that REAL bullying should be addressed in the strongest possible way --- and of course that means teaching boys AND girls not to hit, bite, scratch, shove, push or be abusive in any way.

But when using vocabulary that the another kid doesn't understand is labelled as 'bullying,' then it really waters down the message and you get the basic 'Boy who cried 'wolf' syndrome.' Focus the efforts where they belong: in prevention and intervention of TRUE violent episodes. Otherwise the very word 'bully' becomes so vague and all-inclusive it is rendered meaningless.

PS -- I have a gril, too and the rules about not being violent are the same for ALL my kids! No 'special pass' for being female!



New to AZ --- and missing autumn leaves and the smell of apple orchards!

differentdrum - if you're

me's picture

differentdrum - if you're responding to me stating "you must have all boys", your ASSumption is wrong. I have a daughter and only a daughter.

For the record.....I am the LAST person you need to preach to about a man being physically/verbally abusive with a woman. No man has the right to strike a woman. No woman has the right to strike a man. Got it!! Just want to be clear where i stand on this issue. But lets not let a 5 year old take the blame for all abused women out there. I am not sure where you get your "facts" from, but it seems to me this was one incident and you are ready for a mug shot, fingerprints and a police report for this kindergartner. Jeeez!! So lets not confuse this with making excuses for a 5 year old.

There is nothing wrong with teaching a boy NOT to hit. As there is nothing wrong with teaching a girl NOT to hit. Everyone (in my opinion) should be taught that you can talk all you want and argue all you want, but the first one who gets physical has crossed the line.

I also don't find the humor in your sarcasm about the eggs being sold. Sorry, but i don't see the connection.



The recipe for perpetual ignorance is: be satisfied with your opinions and content with your knowledge.
~ Elbert Hubbard (1856 - 1915)

I agree with "me" -- let's

DesertMom's picture

I agree with "me" -- let's not continue the double standard. It's not just boys who should be taught not to hit girls -- girls should also be taught not to hit boys. In fact they all should be taught not to hit anyone, regardless of gender....

There are plenty of female abusers out there too....



DesertMom
http://ppdsurvivor.blogspot.com

Yes, Right now they are

sdebralh's picture

Yes, Right now they are kids, but they should be taught not to place a hand on one another. This is where it all begins.
If they get away with it now, then they will try and do it in their teens, and then as adults.



One Happy Mom in Arizona.

I would agree with this

GlendaleMom's picture

I would agree with this posting, regardless of what happened, he should be informed to never put a hand on a girl. Yes, the girl should have been punished too, but use this as a learning experience for your son instead of "well she didn't get punished" attitude. Yes, these are just kids, but if they start to get conditioned now to not touch a girl... he could benefit them in the future



There is no way to be a perfect mother, but a million ways to be a good one!

More than anything your son

lovemy4's picture

More than anything your son will take his cues from you. If you say "I'm sorry you were the only one who got in trouble, but you did push, and there is a punishment for that" he'll learn it doesn't matter what others are doing, you care about what he is doing. That is a pretty good lesson to learn in the first week of Kindergarten.

Do you know the poem, "All I Really Need To Know I Learned In Kindergarten"
by Robert Fulghum - ? Here it is...

All I really need to know I learned in kindergarten.

ALL I REALLY NEED TO KNOW about how to live and what to do and how to be I learned in kindergarten. Wisdom was not at the top of the graduate-school mountain, but there in the sandpile at Sunday School. These are the things I learned:

Share everything.

Play fair.

Don't hit people.

Put things back where you found them.

Clean up your own mess.

Don't take things that aren't yours.

Say you're sorry when you hurt somebody.

Wash your hands before you eat.

Flush.

Warm cookies and cold milk are good for you.

Live a balanced life - learn some and think some
and draw and paint and sing and dance and play
and work every day some.

Take a nap every afternoon.

When you go out into the world, watch out for traffic,
hold hands, and stick together.

Be aware of wonder.

Remember the little seed in the styrofoam cup:
The roots go down and the plant goes up and nobody
really knows how or why, but we are all like that.

Goldfish and hamsters and white mice and even
the little seed in the Styrofoam cup - they all die.
So do we.

And then remember the Dick-and-Jane books
and the first word you learned - the biggest
word of all - LOOK.

Everything you need to know is in there somewhere.
The Golden Rule and love and basic sanitation.
Ecology and politics and equality and sane living.

Take any of those items and extrapolate it into
sophisticated adult terms and apply it to your
family life or your work or your government or
your world and it holds true and clear and firm.
Think what a better world it would be if
all - the whole world - had cookies and milk about
three o'clock every afternoon and then lay down with
our blankies for a nap. Or if all governments
had a basic policy to always put thing back where
they found them and to clean up their own mess.

And it is still true, no matter how old you
are - when you go out into the world, it is best
to hold hands and stick together.

I love this poem and it helped me remember that Kindergarten provides more than just mental growth, but a ton of social learning. And sometimes the best lessons come from situations like this. Your son is probably learning that some people are sneaky - good lesson! Life isn't always fair - good lesson! Sitting out a recess isn't fun, so don't get in trouble - etc. etc...

You are right to keep tabs, and you should intervene if things get bad, but I think I'd play it cool for a little while longer. Good luck!!!



Lovemy4 is a discussion leader for North Central Phoenix, tired mother of 4 great kids and wife to one great husband.

Lovemy4 - thanks for sharing

me's picture

Lovemy4 - thanks for sharing that. ;0)



The recipe for perpetual ignorance is: be satisfied with your opinions and content with your knowledge.
~ Elbert Hubbard (1856 - 1915)

Also let your son know that

kelli748's picture

Also let your son know that it is rarely the initial push(er) that gets caught, its the one that retaliates that catches everyones attention. Whether its on the playground or football field, maybe playgrounds need instant replays and kids get a red flag to toss for a challenge....

OOohhhh...what a topic.

MarineMom's picture

OOohhhh...what a topic. Unfortunately, we've had more experience in this area than I'd like in all different forms.

Example: My then 7-year-old got punched in the face by a boy because he thought that she made a picture that made fun of him. (It was a picture she made for her friend and had nothing to do with him). I knew the parents, (as aquaintances), and they lived at the end of the street. I went and talked to the mother. I expected her to ask her son and have him say he didn't do it (which he did) and nothing to come of it. HOWEVER, I did not expect what happened next...which was that she said: "Tell me the truth." Then she said they'd come to our house in a few minutes. He admitted that he punched my daughter, apologized to her, wrote a letter of apology to our family, the principal and a teacher! I was blown away.

Let me say that my kids have been taught NEVER to touch anybody else and do not do so. I believe that the policy within schools should be that no one touches anybody and if anybody pokes, pushes, kicks, punches or hits, especially with malicious intent, that it's wrong. However, we've told our daughters that if they are being hit that they don't have to sit and take it, that they have the right to defend themselves.

My older daughter was being bullied, in 4th grade, by a boy who pretended to be her friend. He'd be smiling and laughing with her and them BAM he'd push her into a door, knock her to the ground or kick her...all when the teacher was out of the classroom (and didn't remember being so, yeah right) or there was a substitute who couldn't/wouldn't handle it. The school was lax in enforcing discipline and I was in the principal's office for the third time...I told the principal flat out that if she gets hurt, you do not want my husband in here. She finally agreed that he would be suspended if anything else happened. Well, this boy took that to mean that if he did anything else to my daughter, he would be suspended.

So he decided to pick on someone else, also thinking he could get away with it. Less then 48 hours later, the same boy, who the teacher told me would 'get over this and it would 'all blow over', hit another boy and ripped his clothing. He got suspended.

Funny how satisfying it was when I walked into my daughter's upcoming middle school office last year, obtaining an honors application for my daughter when I saw this same boy's mother there waiting to talk to the principal.

As I said in another post, my daughter is a black belt in karate and her Dad wanted her to have it so she can defend herself. Another boy tried to intimidate her, (she's a skinny little thing) and tried to punch her in the arm while they were standing in the hall...having practice in sparring, she automatically dodged out of the way and punched him in the arm. He rubbed his arm and said 'ah, that hurt.' And never touched her again.

Now that's an example of a

me's picture

Now that's an example of a boy who may grow up to be an abuser. He was/is a bullying many.

Oh believe me when i say my daughter will be enrolled in some type of martial arts training. To teach her how to defend herself should she ever need it.



The recipe for perpetual ignorance is: be satisfied with your opinions and content with your knowledge.
~ Elbert Hubbard (1856 - 1915)

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